How hard is it to replace the chain and sprockets on a sv650

My chain has started to tighten unevenly again, so I guess it's time for a new one. Last time I had the shop replace just the chain (they said that you only have to replace the sprockets every other time).

This time round I'd like to do the work myself. Do you need special tools to replace a chain?

Is the front sprocket really hard to get to on a SV?

-Antun

Front sprocket can be a *****. You need a 32mm socket and the biggest cheater bar you can find. The special tools you need are chain tools. You can cut the old chain off with a dremel or angle grinder, but you still need tools to mushroom the rivets on the new chain. I put the bike in my truck and went to the Honda dealer (closest) and asked nicely. I think you might be able to put a clip-on type like and ride it over and have them put on the rivet link. Clip-on links are not recommended.

Thanks - I did a quick search online and found this:

http://froogle.google.com/froogle_cluster?btnG=Search+Froogle&hl=en&oid=99109924611189648&pid=4709277296123538723&q=motorcycle+chain+tool&scoring=p

It says it's for "rivet-type" chain links. Is that the same as the "clip-on" ones, or would that tool let me install the recommended chain?

-Antun

I don't know if that will mushroom the rivets or if it will just press the master link plate onto the chain.

Front sprocket can be a B****. You need a 32mm socket and the biggest cheater bar you can find.

An air or electric impact wrench is your friend, zip-zip and the nut is off, no elbow grease required. If you're going to work on your bike a lot, it's a worthwhile investment.

Thanks - I did a quick search online and found this:

http://froogle.google.com/froogle_cluster?btnG=Search+Froogle&hl=en&oid=99109924611189648&pid=4709277296123538723&q=motorcycle+chain+tool&scoring=p

It says it's for "rivet-type" chain links. Is that the same as the "clip-on" ones, or would that tool let me install the recommended chain?

-Antun

that is just part of complete set for chain.what is pictured will only press plate on.
there are different pins and adapters to use with that handle for install.
motion pro also has different tools for chains.
if you using master clip(not recomended)you dont need any special tools at all.
even for rivet you dont need if you get little creative,c clamp and couple hammers.

An air or electric impact wrench is your friend, zip-zip and the nut is off, no elbow grease required. If you're going to work on your bike a lot, it's a worthwhile investment.





Big +1; an electric impact can be had for under $100.

Wish I had bought one when I did the Motosliders install rather than wait until I did my front sprocket. I ended up alternating between cutting, grinding, and torching the left side engine mount bolt after I rounded it off trying to be a he-man. Took me 3-4 hours over a couple days to get that sucker off... >:(

Front sprocket? Took longer to take the impact wrench out of the case and plug in than it did to to actually take the sprocket nut off. Use the right tools!!! ;)

Man, it can be a B*tch to change, but if you got the right tools, you are set.

My approach is to change the chain and sprockets but just attach the chain with a clip link, then go to a dealers and have them do the rivet for me. It costs so little I don't see any point in buying the hardware to do it msyelf. With an oiler, a chain'll do in excess of 15000 miles without much difficulty, so I only need to change chains about once a year- at the rate I pay it'd be the best part of a decade before I'd recoup the cost of even a cheap chain tool.

You can do a rivet link with just a couple of hammers, if you're handy... But personally I don't fancy that.

It doesn't sound like taking the nut off will be a problem - I have an air compressor already, so I just need to buy the air impact wrench attachment for it.

I'll install the clip link and take it to the bike shop to have them install the chain permanently. Can any chain be installeld temporarily with clip links? i.e. do the clip links come in the set?

-Antun

Not all, no. But I've got a link- DID I think- that fits Tsubaki 525 chains so I just use it.

So you mean I have to buy the link separately when I get the chain?

-Antun

So you mean I have to buy the link separately when I get the chain?

-Antun

no,link comes with it.some chains come with both,master and rivet.you canm also buy insame time when buying chain other link if it does not come with it.
links usualy dont mix between different brands of chain.

I've been looking around at chains and it suddenly occured to me that they come in different lengths! Can you buy a new chain in the exact size for an SV650, or do you have to cut it down to size?

If so, I'll have to get a chain breaker tool regardless, right?

-Antun

I've been looking around at chains and it suddenly occured to me that they come in different lengths! Can you buy a new chain in the exact size for an SV650, or do you have to cut it down to size?

If so, I'll have to get a chain breaker tool regardless, right?

-Antun

you may be able to find it in right lenght,they do come in different lenghts.I always buy longer and cut.
you dont need breaker to cut it,grinder works much better.

I did my chain/sprockets in Oct and I only had to use a torque wrench to get off my front sprocket nut. Wasn't nearly that hard but you can always use your foot and leg to apply greater force.

:)

You don't need to grind a chain off. Use a bolt cutter, it takes two seconds.

Also, you can safely use a clip type link on the SV if you want. Just install it properly.

You know that for a fact do you? I'll tell you something, meeting someone who lost a leg below the knee when a clip-link failed on a GS500 convinced me differently. But of course, every failed clip link can be attributed to incorrect fitting can't it...

Just install it properly.

and if it flies off it is not installed properly??
is that only reason it can come off?

OK, so please bear with me while I get this absolutely straight:

1. I don't need any special chain tools whatsoever to remove the old chain, shorten (if necessary) the new chain and install the new chain with a clip link. (The clip link would only be temporary). I *do* need an angle grinder though.

2. Alternatively, I could invest in the proper chain tools, so I wouldn't have to take the bike to the shop to have them attach the chain permanently. For this, I would need:
a) A chain press tool (like this one: http://froogle.google.com/froogle_cluster?q=motorcycle+chain+tool&pid=4709277296123538723&oid=99109924611189648&btnG=Search+Froogle&lmode=&addr=&scoring=p)?
b) EITHER a chain breaker tool (like this one: http://froogle.google.com/froogle_cluster?q=motorcycle+chain+tool&pid=4709277296119710195&oid=18020756919365803386&btnG=Search+Froogle&lmode=&addr=&scoring=p)?
OR
an angle grinder.

I'm trying to figure out whether option 1. or option 2. is the better bet. It looks like the press tool (assuming that's the one I need) costs around $18, and the breaker costs around $25. I don't have an angle grinder (they seem to start at around $35), so it would actually be cheaper to get the breaker too (again, assuming that's the right one).

Would I need any other chain tools?

The SV takes a 525 chain. A lot of the chain tools say that they can be used on 520 chains - does this mean they'll work on a 525 chain too?

Thanks,

Antun

you dont need breaker to cut it,grinder works much better.

get grinder,there are more uses for it in future.chain breaker is worthless,you should still grind head of pin or cheap breaker wont do job.
than get press tool.you would also need pin and plate to flare end of chain pin but you can alternatly use 2 hammers instead.one you hold on back of pin and with other you hit edge of pin so it folds over the plate.

Since I haven't done this before, I'd rather get the tool. I wouldn't know how much to hammer it. Some of the chain tools say they come with different sizes of pins - but they don't mention anything about plates. Do I have to buy a plate separately? Has this (http://froogle.google.com/froogle_cluster?q=motorcycle+rivet+kit&oid=459459593380365205&btnG=Search+Froogle&lmode=&addr=&scoring=p) kit got everything I need? (I know it's called a cam chain kit, but it says that it can also be used on rear drive chains too).

-Antun

you would also need pin and plate to flare end of chain pin but you can alternatly use 2 hammers instead.

Since I haven't done this before, I'd rather get the tool. I wouldn't know how much to hammer it. Some of the chain tools say they come with different sizes of pins - but they don't mention anything about plates. Do I have to buy a plate separately? Has this (http://froogle.google.com/froogle_cluster?q=motorcycle+rivet+kit&oid=459459593380365205&btnG=Search+Froogle&lmode=&addr=&scoring=p) kit got everything I need? (I know it's called a cam chain kit, but it says that it can also be used on rear drive chains too).

-Antun


that link does not take me to picture of tool,just ggogle.
the press tool you posted before is motion pro tool and also comes as set but cost more(around $70).it comes with pins and plates to do everything.
two hammers is realy easy,you just need to tap on edge of pin couple times all around it.second hammer you hold on back so chain does not bounce when you tap it.all you want is edge to fold over so chain plate can not slide out.
if you look at next factory link you see pins are folded on 4 sides but your does not have to look like that(never will :) )
most important thing is to not press link plate to tight and squizee O-rings.link should rotate as easy as rest of them.

and if it flies off it is not installed properly??
is that only reason it can come off?


Of course... the true believers will have it that every clip link that ever fails was incorrectly fitted- since of course, they're completely safe. How do you know they're completely safe? Well, theirs have never fallen off. Why do other people's fall off and not theirs? Good luck? No, obviously it's because they can fit them "properly" which rem,oves any chance of them coming off- and anyone who has them come off clearly doesn't know how to install them. QED. It's pretty flawed logic IMO.

I'm not saying that a clip link will inevitably fail, or that a rivet link will never fail, of course, but to put every failed link down to fitment error is purely presumption without basis.

All this discussion about clip links leads me to wonder: how easy is it for me to mess up the installation of the plates, if I do it myself? Is it something that is either installed properly, or not installed at all, or could I easily install it only to find that one day the link snaps?

-Antun

it is easy.just dont press them in to far.regina links have nice wire thickness of O-rings for this.you put wire between plates so you can not overpress it.
just go slow,look at next link in chain to gauge how much space between plates you need.
buy 2 links just in case,they are cheap.

That is an excellent tip. Before I started using a tiny cable tie or wire, I'd occasionally press one on too far
and deform the o-ring. I think with TWF's tip you have no problem.

I agree totally with Northwind ... circlips have no business on a motorcycle chain.
I had one fail and this is after I caught it 3 times missing the retaining clip and replacing the whole thing.

I did not get hurt but it totalled the bike ... chain wrapped around counter shaft and bike was not
worth fixing because it was already 5 years old.

Some claim RTV sealant will lock the circlip in place, I say not ...

Use the rivets, same price and safer.

I have a $50 Emgo chain riveter that works fine for SV chains. If you don't have an angle grinder, you can use a dremel with the little grinding wheel or a drill and a grinding wheel.

I had a clip type master link clip come off on my SV once. It was installed correctly and I used RTV as well.

Also, when you wipe down the chain with a rag, sometimes the rag will catch on the edge of the clip and loosen or bend it if you wipe in the direction against the clip ends. I will never use a clip link again, it's not worth the risk, however big or little it is.

I posted this up on another board a few months ago, and it may help those contemplating a chain swap.* The change is on a Kawi ZX12, but the steps are the same.

And, for what it's worth,* I always budget getting the correct tools, or borrow a friends correct tools, for a job.* Do it one time, do it right.* Using the wrong tool is OK in the field, but only in an emergency.* There is enough sh!t to worry about on the road, without hoping that your chain doesn't let go and take your case, or your leg, off with it.

The Motion-Pro kit is about $90 new, and it is worth it!* Includes a pin driver to remove the pin, a plate press to press the plate back on, and a pin flare to flare the tips of the new master link.

==========================================

Changed out the chain and sprockets this weekend.* *I had a gentle 22,000 miles on this set, and although things looked still in serviceable condition,* I felt it was indeed just better to do this in the relative comfort of my garage instead of having to wait on the side of the road somewhere in Hardee county for a tow,* or an ambulance!* I had no obvious signs of eminent failure, however things to look for when servicing your chain are tight spots/small kinks,* smooth points on the sprockets where it should be shaped surfaces.* Of course, your service manual will also give you advice on how to measure chain stretch and sprocket wear.

Tools you will need:
Impact wrench (air or electric) & sockets
Torque wrench
Die Grinder to grind the chain rivet head
* * * * a Dremel tool may work, but it will take a while
Chain Breaker and Chain Press tool ? I used Motion Pro here
of course, new chain and sprockets.*
Some way to get the rear of the bike in the air.* Rear stand is the obvious way, but you could suspend it from the ceiling.

My service manual states that front and rear sprockets should be replaced whenever a new chain is put on the bike.* Failure to do so will result in premature wear of the chain.* I replaced my sprockets with JT Steel sprockets, front and back, and put on a gold RK530 X-Ring chain.

Note:* Again, the 530 chain was for a ZX12.* My SV650 takes a 525.

Cost:
Front sprocket : $15
Rear Sprocket:* $35
Chain: $140
Time required:*
plan on a minimum of two hours, and could go to three depending on how fast you work.

These are the steps I followed:
1.)* Replace the front sprocket
2).* Remove the old chain from the bike using a chain-break tool
3).* Replace the rear sprocket
4).* Mount the new chain on the bike using a chain-rivet tool.
Note: this is JTCMA ... the order of the steps, the steps I followed, the torque values and other references are just documenting what I did to make this adjustment on my bike.* Your values and steps may be different.* Also, please remember to always wear safety glasses when working on your bike!




Step 1. Replace the front sprocket

Small Note:* Notice that I am replacing the front sprocket completely before cutting the chain, because the chain is used to hold the sprocket from spinning when you loosen / tighten the nut on the shaft.* If you cut the chain off first,* the front sprocket will spin when trying to remove/tighten the nut.* That is because you should have the tranny in neutral when taking this nut off/on.

HUGE NOTE:* Please make sure your transmission is in NEUTRAL before whacking the sprocket nut on or off.* If it is in gear it will put un-necessary strain on the transmission gears and could cause gear failure.* That's why I leave the chain on to do the front sprocket.

Remove the chain guard.

Remove the front sprocket cover. Picture (http://members.aol.com/alan0252/myhomepage/Chain/1-Remove_Front_Sprocket.jpg)

If you have a washer that bends over the flats on the nut, you will need to straighten the washer out before you can remove the nut.

Have someone stand on the rear brake pedal.* Use an impact wrench to remove the front sprocket nut.* I suppose you could try and use a ½? breaker bar and about 4-feet of pipe as a cheater, but good luck!* That didn?t work for me.* You can get a cheap electric one from HarborFreight for about $50 , and it?s worth it!*

Anyway, once the nut is off,* you will not be able to just pull the sprocket off until you get the chain off of it.* * To do that, loosen the rear axle, and then loosen the chain all the way in, by backing off the chain adjusters* as far as you can.* You may even need to remove the chain off the rear sprocket.* Picture (http://members.aol.com/alan0252/myhomepage/Chain/2-Loosen_Chain.jpg)

Once you have enough slack in the drive chain,* you should be able to loosen it from around the front sprocket enough to pull it off the splined countershaft.*

Put the new front sprocket on by reversing those steps.* Slip it into the slack chain, then slide it on the the splined countershaft.

Then put the washer and nut back on.* Since you will be applying a torque force to these items, my manual suggested putting grease between the new sprocket/washer/nut sliding surfaces,* and oiling up the threads on the countershaft with engine oil.* That?s a good idea!* Picture (http://members.aol.com/alan0252/myhomepage/Chain/3-New_Front_Sprocket.jpg)

Take the slack out of the chain in the rear by sliding the rear axle back into position and either sliding the adjusters out, or temporarily tightening the axle nut.

Grab your helper, have him stand on the rear brake pedal.* You may also want to slip a 2x4 under the swingarm and in front of the spoke to help hold the rear tire from turning.
Then torque the nut to spec.* Mine was 94 ft/lbs.* Bend one of the flats over on the washer, if so equipped, and take a well-deserved break. *

You are done with one-quarter of the project.




Step 2. Break the chain

With a die grinder, grind off the head of one of the rivets on your existing chain.* If you do not have a die grinder, you may be able to do this with a Dremel and a whole bunch of cutting wheels ( the rivets are pretty hard!). Picture (http://members.aol.com/alan0252/myhomepage/Chain/4-Grind_Rivet.jpg)

Note:cover your work area, swingarm, tire, etc,* with newspaper or cardboard, just in case your hand slips while grinding the chain

Using your chain breaker, push out the remainder of the pin you just ground the head off of.* Picture (http://members.aol.com/alan0252/myhomepage/Chain/5-Break_Old_Chain.jpg)

Alright!* Time for another little break ? you?re half-way there!




Step3. Replace the Rear Sprocket
Step three isn?t too tough.* Remove the rear wheel.* When it is off, do not lay it down on the disc brake rotor!* That could warp it.* Maybe lay the wheel on the floor where the ?rim? is sitting on some 2x4?s, or use a milk crate.* Remove the 5 or 6 bolts holding the old sprocket on the wheel, and pull the sprocket off. Picture (http://members.aol.com/alan0252/myhomepage/Chain/6-New_Rear_Sprocket.jpg)

I used a little wire brush to clean the threads on the rim.* They had remnants of Loc-Tite on them, and it is always a good idea to clean that stuff out of the threads in order to have a clean surface to thread in to again.*

Once clean,* I mounted the new sprocket on the studs, then dabbed a little blue Loc-Tite on the exposed studs, put the nuts back on.* My torque value was 43 ft/lbs.* Always a good idea to tighten things like this in a star-pattern rather than just going around in a circle.* Ensures an even pressure is being applied to all surfaces and prevents warping.

O-o-o-o!* Isn?t that pretty! Enjoy looking at it.* You will never see it that clean again!

Remount the rear wheel back on to the bike.* Set the chain adjusters to total slack, so the axle will be as far towards the front of the bike as possible.

OK, you are in the home stretch.* Only one more task to tackle.




Step 4. Mount the New Chain
Your new chain will probably be a little too long.* You will need to measure it on the bike to see where to break it.* It also should come with a new master link.
Mount the new chain on the bike.* Remember, the rear wheel/axle should be as far forward as possible to permit you to get the chain somewhat tight on the bike.

Overlap the chain ends, and mark the link you will be removing. Pull as much of the slack out of the chain as reasonably possible here.* Measure twice, cut once!* You will be removing an ?outer link? assembly from the chain, and replacing it with the new master link, which is also an outer link assembly. Picture (http://members.aol.com/alan0252/myhomepage/Chain/7-Break_New_Chain.jpg)

Remove the chain from the bike.

Just for grins, lay the new chain and the old chain side by side to confirm you are cutting the right location.* At $140+* you don?t want to screw this part up.

Remove the parts of the new chain you do not need.* It is done just like you did above to cut off the old chain, i.e. grind off the head, push out the pin.

Thread the new chain back on to the bike.* Have the two loose ends meet up on the rear sprocket. The rear sprocket will hold things in place for you.* Slide the new master link in from the back side towards you.* Your chain will have new o-rings and (possibly) a grease packet to lube the master link.

Use your chain press to press on the master link assembly.* Don?t forget to put your new washers on before you press the new plate on.* You will be ****** if you find them on the garage floor AFTER you get everything put together ?. Can you say ?$140 mistake?? ?

Use your chain tool to expand the rivet heads on the master link pins.

The last step is to adjust your chain, as normal, and then tighten up the adjusters and axle nut per specs.* Mine was 94 ft/lbs.

Bloody knuckles? Dirty fingernails? Did the kids learn some new naughty words?* Yup, you?re a bona-fide mechanic now.

Now you just need to finish up replacing any parts you removed to start with: chain guard, sprocket cover, shift lever, whatever ?

You should check the adjustment at 50 miles, and then after 200 miles.

Excellent write up!

Contact a mod and see if it can be posted in the www.svrider.com How-To section.

The forum is a great place to lose great information <grin>

Of course... the true believers will have it that every clip link that ever fails was incorrectly fitted- since of course, they're completely safe. How do you know they're completely safe? Well, theirs have never fallen off. Why do other people's fall off and not theirs? Good luck? No, obviously it's because they can fit them "properly" which rem,oves any chance of them coming off- and anyone who has them come off clearly doesn't know how to install them. QED. It's pretty flawed logic IMO.

Ahh yes, the true believers. Yes, we will have it and we won't need luck, we're riding an SV with a paltry 65hp.

Truth is the rivet link is good too. Wait a minute, it's infallible. The pins cannot crack and fail no matter what. Even if installed with two hammers, or maybe three. Heck, what about the old vise grip and BB trick?

Nobody's said that rivet links are infllible. But people have said that clip links only fail if wrongly installed. Or did you miss that?

I mentioned the guy I met who'd laost a leg to a failed clip link? He was riding a DRZ400, they make about 40bhp. Low power is no safeguard. The things can fail. I'm not saying they always do, or that they're lethally dangerous, or even massively worse than rivet links, but they're weaker, and they can fail. But the true believers that i refer to will say, every single time, "It must have been installed incorrectly".

No guarantees in life Northwind, that's for sure.

karlovac,

-you can remove the countersprocket nut by taking about 18 inches of old chain and wrap it around itself on the sprocket 'til it's up against the shroud or case. Put the tranny in nuetral and use breaker bar.

- use bolt cutter to remove old chain

- buy a Chinese grinder for $20 to grind down pins when shortening the chain.

- Motion Pro has some individual tools you can buy for the plates and another for pushing pins. I got mine cheap at my dealer. When I install a rivet type link I borrow a buddy's RK chain tool kit. I like it much better than the kit from Motion Pro. I'm sure it's expensive though.

-Also, while you're at it. Check out the Motion Pro chain alignment tool. It's a ridiculously overpriced piece of kit, but I've had pretty good luck with it.

-you can remove the countersprocket nut by taking about 18 inches of old chain and wrap it around itself on the sprocket 'til it's up against the shroud or case. Put the tranny in nuetral and use breaker bar.


you kidding?

Yikes,

You could end up with room for a very big countershaft sprocket

(sorry to revive an old thread)

I have a question - will it damage it if I use my 1/2" drive torque wrench (set to it's max ft-lb) with a "breaker-bar" to remove the front sprocket? Or do I need to use a non-ratcheting, 1/2" drive wrench (and breaker-bar) just for this?

[edit: this is assuming I do not have access to an impact wrench!]

Torque wrenches are delicate instruments that are calibrated
to do a function. Go to some auto supply store and get a
breaker bar for 15 bucks and put a pipe on that.

It can cost you up to a hundred bucks to replace a torque
wrench. Use the correct tool for the job.

Or, if it's a cheap rubbish torque wrench, consider relegating it to breaker duties and getting a better torque wrench...

TBH, with high-value torque wrenches (which I assume is what you're using here) for motorbike use you're not usually all that bothers about accuracy- + or - 10% is a huge error for a torque wrench but isn't generally enough to cause problems on the handful of things you'd use a big one for (axles, sprockets, steering stem, engine bolts being the main ones). Just to step out of the ideal world for a moment there.

well, this was messed up.... I didn't even need a breaker bar for the front sprocket... as a matter of fact, I didn't even need the torque wrench! I used a 1/2" drive socket wrench and the thing came right off easily... :confused3:
I hope that the 105 ft/lb on my torque wrench is correct, because now it's got me worried...

Is that the first time it's been changed? Mine was like that from the factory, barely finger tight.

Did you put loc-tite and torque it?

loc-tite on the front sprocket? - no. should I have? I thought about it, but I figured the 105 ft/lb is enough to keep the thing on there good...

and i think it's at least the second time... I can't be sure though, it's a used bike, but the chain was a clip-type chain, so at least the chain was changed... Maybe it was stock, because the wavy washer was only bent once... And now that I think about it, the sprockets looked like the stock sprockets... :dontknow: